To the extreme upset of the party, the train guards of House Orien insisted on arresting someone for the fight which led to the derailment of the train: by virtue of being the only survivors of the fight, this had to be the party. After some debate, the party went without resistance if not cheerily. Escorted under guard to Sharn, they were immediately released upon arrival when their sponsor, Dakkath d'Tharashk, vouched for them. He promptly made it clear to them that they needed to a) get out of Sharn and b) raise some money to appease the higher-ups in House Tharashk who were having to pay damages to House Orien. This was considered to eminently reasonable.
The party now split in two. Vespa and Ulmo sought out Auntine Pidrasso to return the book and (Vespa hoped) to convince him he needed guards for his own protection. The latter failed, but Pidrasso suggested that they seek out the laboratory described in the rear of the book, hinting that there might be many exotic magical goods therein as well as information on the magical box. The lab is supposed to be found in the Demon Wastes, a rich source of valuable Khyber dragonshards.
Lawful Zoe, however, took Ristiik along on a more direct approach: she went to her home temple of Dol Arrah and asked for a quest. After some debate, the bishop a) suggested they seek out the lost Toenail of St Apothecary, to be found somewhere near Greywall in Droaam (a nation of monsters ruled by a triumverate of hags), and b) baptised Ristiik as Hungry Edward. More research suggested that the relic was either still in the abandoned village (a former Brelish colony overrun 15 years ago in a border war between Breland and Droaam), or had been taken by the Hags of Droaam as a bargaining chip.
The plan was eventually decided (I think) that the party would sail up the River Dagger and then travel overland to Ardev, posing as merchants selling women's underthings (for the wives of the nobles and soldiers posted at the nearby Castle Arakhain) and pornography (for the soldiers). From there, they would try to negotiate access to Droaam, collect the relic, and then head north to the Demon Wastes to investigate the laboratory.
Having sorted all this out, and negotiated a contract to guard Hamel of Galethspyre as he delivered a cart to Castle Arakhain, the party were setting out when they were accosted by a tiefling named Lividus, who Ristiik had met earlier in the day. He asked the party to hand over the book, and with some apparent reluctance, attacked them (joined by the warforged artificer from the attack on the train) when they refused. The battle was extremely difficult, and in the end Lividus escaped, teleporting away to another level of Sharn. Vespa, however, chased down the warforged artificer, who committed suicide rather than be taken.
Content by Bjorn Christianson
Forgot to mention, we're going to use a modified version of the rarity rules. Common items can be purchased anywhere; Uncommon items can only be found in major commerical centres. Rare items are not generally available for sale at all; check with me if there's one you'd really like.
Since you've just come from Sharn, you can assume you have had free access to all common and uncommon items.
Yeah, Zoe's share of that money is long gone.
Good adventure that one. On the mechanical side of things, I find these newer baddies quite deadly. Ongoing and aura damage might as well be a death spell for lower level characters. I'm also surprised that Lividius didn't TPK us by himself.
Not to bang my own gong, but if there's something to be learned from the D&D Tournaments is that starting positions and party balance seem to be the biggest determinants of success or not in an encounter. In this game so far, we seem to be caught in "exploration mode" and having poor start points.Party balance seems quite good, though. I felt that we didn't have enough range at first, but then I remembered Alec's dog thing was quite powerful.
Sorry, yes. 550 gp was the total for your post-adventure total stripping of the forge. I am now confused about the Forgemaster Gloves -- in the notes I can find from before the hiatus, it's an item you were supposed to get, but checking the web logs you didn't get it at the forge? Well, whatever, you picked it up somewhere.
Also, going forward, Bob will not get a share of the loot as is no longer being implemented as a PC. Just assume that the loot you find has already had his salary subtracted, and that he is making his own items.
Party impressions: I was pleasantly surprised at how effective the binder is. There isn't a lot of hard control, but the "if you do this you will take damage" has screwed over a few fights, and in particular accounted for a fair chunk of damage on Lividus.
Zoe is another big source of damned-if-you-do damage, obviously, but with the new hard-hitting monster design, you guys might regret having your big source of player healing in your defender.
Ristiik is an amazing glass cannon, not much to say. Bit harder to say about Vespa. I want to say that Vespa is really effective when she can do her thing, but is not too hard to put in sub-ideal circumstances, but in reality it probably mostly comes down to Alex' inability to roll well except in non-combat situations. ;)
Vespa is a very simple character. What more is there to say about an alpha-female dominatrix-themed rogue that inadvertently trained as a ranger by mistake, having modelled herself on a genre character from different media?
I've swapped out Ristiik's 'Improved rageblood vigour' feat (which gave him 8 temporary Hp rather than 3 when dropping an enemy) because dropping enemies doesnt happen as often as I thought it might. Instead I took 'Hafted defence' which gives him +1 AC and REF when using a spear. Coupled with His lvl 4 feat which improves his AC by 2 when wearing hide armour and his innate bonus improvement, his AC is a respectable 20 now.
I have a wish list of future feats now that will make him tougher - some resistance to ongoing, Improving surge value etc. He's got loads of surges, just need to get some opportunities to use em...
Bjorn the poison I was trying to buy in the market (bloodroot I think) has a listed value of 0 Gp. Can you set a price before I decide to take an infinite supply ??
Bjorn: I realise Vespa may be weak; she's been designed to fit a pre-existing character concept (as Gary pointed out!) plus with out-of-combat skills in mind rather than to max combat capabilities. I'm OK with this; just hope it's not too annoying for the rest of the party. And she hasn't died yet.
Maybe it's just me, but I find 4e very sensitive to choices during combat. After every fight I'm left cursing not my dice rolls (which I've given up on now) but the order of my power choices or my placement, thinking "if only I'd done X instead of Y at time Z, or moved to this square rather than that square at that moment". It seems tiny mistakes can have major repercussions. (A big difference from earlier editions where it was mostly a matter of hit-point attrition plus a bit of luck.)
Dave: Any poison with a cost of 0 gp that comes from Heroes of Shadow is actually a daily power from the Executioner class, despite showing up in the marketplace, and so not for sale.
Alex: I don't think Vespa's weak, just "tactically fragile" if you understand what I mean. When Vespa is free to do what she is supposed to do, she's very effective; it's just that it seems the tactical situation often forces her into making decisions she'd rather not make. No questions that she is the stand-out character out-of-combat, though.
Bjorn / Alex: In general, I'm a fairly limited player - but I have presided over a fair number of games. If you ask me, one of the Vespa problems (from my point of view) is that there is a disconnect between the character design (being a ranger and having the quarry etc) and the characterisation (being an assassin type). If it were me, I wouldn't be able to get around that with all the ranger-y powers etc.
If it were me (and it's not) I'd give serious consideration to re-making Vespa as a straight up rogue or assassin (although assassins are a bit iffy), and building the katar two-weapon thing in as part of the fiction. Maybe give it a go for a session.
If you are having problems with power selection, go for the thief. As an essentilas build, it should remove a lot of that and bring it closer to an earlier edition character.
The ranger covers most of the two weapon fighting stuff, and the assassin gives the 'power up/finishing moves' thing that the Diablo assassin has. I think the character concept is fine. One thing you notably dont have is the min/maxed stats that seem to be almost universal in 4e (ie 20,14,11,10,10,8.
What are the key features you want represented in the character build?
Forgemaster gloves give you 5 fire resist and a daily power of adding 1d6 fire damage to a weapon strike.
We should certainly keep them. Ristiik would obviously love them but Im sure so would Zoe or Vespa
Gary: I think the confusion's in the name. I started building Vespa as a Rogue but Bjorn correctly pointed out that Ranger was a much better fit (as Dave says), as the Diablo 'Assassin' is really just a specialised fighter with extra 'trap' powers; not very Roguey at all. Vespa lacks the trap powers but it's hard enough trying to specialise in both two-weapon fighting (with an Exotic weapon) and thrown weapons (with another Exotic) at the same time without trying to add a third specialisation. And even in Diablo most builds specialised in traps or melee rather than trying to cover all bases. Implementing some of Vespa's Powers in the form of 'traps' might solve this, but they would then be in a form that would seem rather 'magical' for a class described as 'mage killers'. Whereas realistic traps would be encumbering and not suited to deployment in melee.
Dave: You're right about Vespa being gimped in terms of her stats - in creating her I made the mistake of thinking of 4e as a roleplaying game! But I prefer playing her that way; makes it more 'realistic' (and challenging). Reckon I should get bonus XP for playing 'hardcore'. (And Ristiik can have 13 gp off Vespa.)
There's two things that have changed: the free expertise feat and Inherent Bonuses. Inherent Bonuses provides bonuses to hit, damage, defences, and extra crit dice that do not stack with the bonuses you get from magic items (they both provide enchantment bonuses)-- at any given point, you choose the best of either Inherent Bonuses or what any magic items you might have would give you. Since we're now at level 4, everyone gets +1 to hit, +1 to damage, +1 to all defences, and +1d6 damage on crits from Inherent Bonuses.
The free expertise feat, on the other hand, provides (at this point) +1 to hit which does stack with magic items/Inherent Bonuses. So your to-hit at this point should be your ability modifier + 2 (half level) + 1 (enchantment bonus) + 1 (expertise bonus) (+ proficiency bonus if you're a weapon user). So assuming I remember things correctly, Zoe and Ristiik should be +12 to hit, while Vespa should be either +10 or +9 depending on whether she's using Dex or Str, and Ulmo is +8 (I think, can't remember if he's 18 or 20 Charisma).
Hi all.
Good effort all round, that was quick and brutal.
So Bjorn isn't having to sandbox it on the fly, should we have the discussion here as to where we're going next and what we're trying to do?
I'm open to any suggestions, but I do think it's a bit vague that we have two quests, one involving searching a wasteland the size of Mongolia for an instruction book (that may or may not exist); and the other is searching a very small geographic area for a small artifact that hasn't been seen in the area for a hundred years, despite dozens of quests.
So in short, despite the obvious narrative, I think we should settle on one or the other, and maybe work out where we're going with these houses. At the moment, we're not even pawns - we're kind of the pawns of the pawns. I'm not even sure why we're after the instructions for the cube - basically we'll hand it over and best case scenario we'll build up enough mitzvah to be allowed on the trains again. In the meantime, it looks like it's going to be a road movie with us picking up rumours and clues along the way, and I'm not sold on the idea of searching these enormous "Demon Wastes".
We are where we are, and we've got some currency in terms of travelling into Monster country. Given the choice, I'd be all for powering up there with some slightly less open-ended objectives, and then returning to the House in a better position to actually do work on our own terms, rather than just being a bunch of fetchers/carriers.
NB: The reason Vespa cares about the cube and by extension the instructions on how to use it is that Eberron has suffered a long history of magically-induced catastrophes and invasions from other planes, and she is concerned the cube might be a powerful artefact that some irresponsible sorcerous type might use to instigate another. The fact that people were fighting to retrieve the cube and now powerful forces are sending bounty hunters after us/the book lends weight to he fears.
And there might be instructions in the magical lab on how to make even nicer mechanical birds!
Ok, this is obviously meta-gaming rather than a simulated in-game discussion - but although Zoe is as dumb as a box of rocks, it's one thing to search a specific village for a specific item (the relic) - we'll probably find a clue to the suspected whereabouts and fight a den full of local toughs - and either recover it or not.
But even to Zoe and Riistik, and I suspect to the much smarter Ulmo and Vespa - without something more tangible, I don't see us travelling from Barcelona to Greenland to look for a something about the size of a branch of Halfords. And the idea that we'll somehow "just pick up info on the way", I find absurd. There are campaigns where dumb people stumble on big things through serendipity, but I don't get the sense that this is one of them - so far there have been political powerplays, complex interactions between the Houses and so on.
If we're going to strike out into the wilderness, Zoe's all in. But from the game/campaign point of view, I have my doubts. This seems one sandbox too far. Anyone who has the old 1e module "Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun" will know what I mean from the insert map - (500 5 mile hexes of wilderness, and one of them has the temple in it). I don't know what the story rationale is for us looking for the instructions, but from an objective point of view, it's like sending a group of A-level History students off to find the Ark of the Covenant and giving them a tourist map of Bruges as a starting point.
Great analogy Gary.LOL And also a great evening's entertainment.
My comments:-
1. I see the 'finding the instructions' objective as a medium to long term goal that we may end up abandoning or not as our whims take us. The box is an object that has aroused a lot of interest and has almost got us killed. It is therefore an interesting theme to stay involved with as budding adventurers.
2. Whilst progressing toward the long term goal there is nothing to stop us going on side quests such as the religious artifact as time does not appear to be of the essence.
3. We asked around the city and these were the best ideas that anyone could come up with.
4. On the metagaming level if Bjorn had wanted to have a more concrete adventure for us to get involved with he could have easily have manouvered us into one I suspect. As it is he came up with a murder mystery that I found very enjoyable. If he had wanted us to go down some different route then either we are completely dense and missed the clues or they were far too subtle for us to pick up on.
5. It is possible we weren't meant to leave the city so quickly but to stay and guard the box perhaps but we weren't given any incentive to do so, therefore, I can only conclude that Bjorn is happy for us to bumble about as we are.
6. As we have no overriding purpose, as characters, to achieve anything in particular from a doctrinal or similar point of view Ulmo is happy to meander wherever fortune and the evil machinations of the DM takes us. If anyone wishes to change the direction of where we are heading and do something completely different I am happy to go along with it, as long as Ulmo gets to smite evil along the way that is all he cares about.
In order to give Bjorn some guidance I would say we should head up to the castle first to sell our silken thingies, then head over to Droarn to look for the artifact.
Bjorn Christianson (06/11/2011 09:35:28)
Everyone has now gained enough experience to get to level 4. In addition to the 200 gp you were payed by House Tharashk, the loot you took from the duergar forge was worth 550 gp. You found only one magical item not cursed or malfunctioning, and that was a pair of Forgemaster's Gloves.